Is This Hatred or Love?

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By Ahmadi Muslimah
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Assalaamu ‘Alaikum wa Rahmatullahi ta’ala wa barakatuhu,
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A new allegation has come to light in which an assumption has been made against the intentions of a member of Lajna Imaillah who the accuser says incited and encouraged hatred towards Muslims by asking Ahmadi ladies at University to avoid joining Islamic Societies and to be cautious with who they take as friends. I was thus compelled to pen a reply to this utterly absurd and opportunistic allegation.
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It’s a chilly November afternoon, I have just finished college lectures for the day and at a nearby University I have been invited to an Islamic question and answer session. I go along wanting to learn about Islam, as I am sitting waiting for the seminar room to fill with guests, I can feel the tension in the air. It was certainly odd, nothing I had experienced before; a few months prior to this, a tragedy struck the world – the 9/11 attacks.
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I expected to see the seminar room to be filled with non-Muslims. Quite to the contrary, the room was full of Muslims, “wow!” I thought, “This, is how Muslims stick together”.
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The question and answer session proceeded, respected dignitaries made their introductions. Amongst them were Abdul Ghany Jahangeer Khan Sahib (now Missionary incharge of Central French Desk) and Ibrahim Noonan Sahib (The first Irish Imam in Ireland – Galway). They were representing the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community and went on to give a quick synopsis of who they are and what they follow. As the session proceeded, I heard a large uproar of disagreements, sniggering and paper throwing? I know, we were in a seminar room, but this wasn’t high school! Then I heard a man exclaim “Allahu Akbar!” And run down the steps of the seminar room shouting “Kaafirs!” My thoughts were: I don’t want to die today! Why did they have to hijack a University event? And to top it off, utter embarrassment, the man was someone well known to me.
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The seminar was cut short due to constant interruptions. I was left confused as to why there was so much hate towards the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community, surely the variety of societies at University encourages diversity and tolerance. I was also rather annoyed; I took time out to attend an intellectual seminar, which was consequently hijacked by fundamentalists!
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During this time it became common practice to have Ahmadis removed from prayer rooms by members of another Islamic Society at University. The latter scenes were repeated and over a period of time the events ceased over safety concerns.
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This occurred almost a decade ago (I’m showing my age now), so since these events, what has occurred for the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community to become concerned for the safety and well-being of young Ahmadis? 2010 saw a rise in hate crimes in the UK, this time, specifically towards the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community.
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“A police investigation was launched last month, after police saw leaflets being handed out calling on Muslims to murder Qadiyanis, a derogatory term for Ahmadiyya Muslims.”
If non-Ahmadi Muslims are ostracizing Ahmadi Muslims, surely it would be sound advice to discourage joining Islamic Student Societies as some young Ahmadi Ladies may not be aware of previous wrongdoings.
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9/11 and 7/7 attacks highlighted a new breed of fundamentalist, home grown and educated people being recruited at University. So, picture this; your daughter or little sister is starting University tomorrow and everything is checked off the list of “to do’s”. What advice would you give to her? Any parent, sibling and friend would want their daughter, sister or friend to have fun, enjoy University, study, but most of all – stay safe. Any Lajna Imaillah leader has a duty towards Lajna and Nasirat, which requires of them that they give such useful advice, and rightly so as she is following the objectives laid down for her in Lajna’s constitution.
ix) You shall always pay attention to enhancement of your moral and spiritual standard and shall not merely restrict your attention just to eating, drinking and clothing yourself. You shall fully help each other in this matter and think and devise ways and means to achieve this.
x) You shall specially realize your duty regarding the Tarbiyat of your children and shall not let them be alienated from their religion or become lazy and ignorant. Instead you shall try to make them active, alert and able to bear hardships. Teach them all the matters about religion which you are aware of and inculcate in them ~the love and obedience~ of Allah, The Holy Prophet (SAW), Hadrat Masih Mau’ood (A.S.) and Hadrat Khilafatul Masih. They should be trained and prepared to spend their lives in accordance with the teachings of Islam. The means to achieve this end should be thought and put into action.”
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Similar to this problem are the social issues that can be encountered through the use of Facebook.
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It is advised to consider what kind of lifestyle friends have, and what social activities they are engaged in. Muslims should follow the Islamic teaching of hijab/purdah, refrain from alcohol and avoid / give up all those things which are inconsistent with the moral goals of Islam. This is not to say that all non-Muslim friends are immoral and non-religious – not at all. Muslims should be open, compassionate and friendly to everyone. However, Allah stresses the importance of choosing believers as your true friends. The Holy Qur’an advises that Muslims should prefer believers to disbelievers when choosing their intimate friends. Regarding which friends a person should choose, Almighty Allah says:
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“And help one another in righteousness and piety; but help not one another in sin and transgression.” (5:3)
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Thus, it is better to choose close friends based upon their compatibility with the moral and spiritual goals of the Islamic way of life – regardless of who they are.
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What is the Jama’at’s Role?
Now, what role can and should the Jama’at play in raising Ahmadi Children? The best thing the Jama’at can and does do, under the divinely guided Institution of Khilafat, is to invite us all to volunteer our time and services for the service of Almighty Allah. What we can gain from jama’at is directly proportional to what we invest in it. If we wish to raise our children properly, we should selflessly serve the jama’at with our families.
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Active participation in Jama’at and auxiliary activities provides a meaningful alternative to the wasteful activities, and in a healthy social environment. With the current technology, distance should not be an issue. We can participate through MTA, e‐mails, teleconferences, and the like.
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In short, the advice offered encourages caution, purdah and awareness. Advice as a mother would give to her daughter. Was this hatred or love? I choose LOVE!
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May Allah shower all the Jama’at leaders and officials with His choicest blessings. On a side note, please could everyone remember our newly elected Sadr Sahiba in your special prayers!
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Find an AMWSA (Ahmadiyya Muslim Womens’ Student Association) near you! If you are a current university student or in years 12 or 13 (college/sixth form) get in contact with them and request a registration form!
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I would like to leave you with a final thought to ponder over, a beautiful tradition of the Holy Prophet (saw). Abu Hurairah (ra) related that the Holy Prophet (saw) said:
“ Whoever believes in Allah and the Day of Judgement should not put his neighbour to inconvenience. Whoever believes in Allah and the Day of Judgement should treat his guest with respect. Whoever believes in Allah and the Day of Judgement should only say that which is good or else remain quiet.” (Sahih Bukhari)
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Wasalaam
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99 thoughts on “Is This Hatred or Love?

  1. I agree with ‘Nemo’s’ first post. Yes, the arguments against are valid in the unfortunate circumstances that do exist in today’s universities, and for that Tauseef Khan’s clarification post (October 5, 2011 at _:30 pm) hits the nail on the head. As this blog is read by an international audience, I feel there is need to emphasise more on a positive point that seems to have only been brought by one contributor to this lengthy discussion – ‘AcidFlow’ (October 5, 2011 at _:00 pm).

    Why are we as Ahmadi Muslims focusing only on the defensive? Yes, as ‘Ahmadi Muslimah’s’ post states, the protection of our youth is very important, and cannot be understated. But we are a progressive Jama’at and should not stop at just this. We can’t take an approach of “I get conflict at uni so I will just wait for the next Khuddam/Lajna event to experience brother/sisterhood”. We can’t take the approach of “I will only interact with people like me because I don’t want to pick up bad habits from other people”. Yes of course keeping good company is encouraged, but that should not be anyone’s excuse to not mingle with “bad people”. Are we really in a position to be making that judgement? Can we honestly say that there is no good to be learnt from any given individual?

    It is important that before going off to university, the youth are sufficiently equipped with strength of faith. It is an impressionable age and we may fear that Ahmadi Muslim youth could be steered away. Steered away by whom? Other youth. Other youth who are just as impressionable. Why is it only that their way should impress ours? Why can’t we impress the great values of Islam Ahmadiyyat upon them?

    University is a great place to be exposed to different people. I think if you leave university having learnt everything about your degree subject matter, but nothing of people, you have not utilised your time well. The instructions set out to not join Islamic Societies should not be taken as instruction not to interact at all with non-Ahmadi Muslims. If we open-heartedly invite someone to an AMSA gathering, it would be arrogant not to attend a love-promoting event by another society (with or without fear of one or two hostiles).

    I guess the point I’m trying to make is let not the condition in some British universities lead us down a ‘cult’ path. Fortunate are those like ‘AcidFlow’ who live in more tolerant societies. Such tolerance in British universities should not be given up on. If Ahmadi students don’t work towards it who will? It might be tempting to take the “OK fine leave us alone to do our own thing” approach, but will that promote harmony with our Muslim brothers and sisters? They may not as yet have accepted the message of Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as), but who else will share it with them?

    I grew up and live primarily surrounded by non-Ahmadi Muslims and non-Muslims. On meeting a non-Ahmadi Muslim, admittedly I wouldn’t open with “Hi, I’m an Ahmadi”, just as I wouldn’t open with “Hi, I’m a Muslim” when speaking to a Christian/Hindu/Jew etc. Eventually a relationship may progress to a point where specifics of religion are discussed at what point I state “Ahmadi”. Now it looks like many contributors to this thread at this point get shunned. In most of my experiences, the response I would get is
    “What’s that?”
    This includes Muslims in the UK. Muslims who are part of ISocs/MSocs. Muslims who would for the first time be hearing that the Mahdi and Messiah has arrived. At this point I wonder if this meeting hadn’t happened how long would they have lived without meeting an Ahmadi. I wonder how long it will be before they cross paths with another Ahmadi. I wonder what their response would be if they met someone, in the future, who had bad things to say about Ahmadiyyat. It is my sincerest prayer and that they respond with something along the lines of, “I met an Ahmadi at uni once, he seemed ok, I think you have misunderstood them.” I’m not claiming to be some amazing stand-out Ahmadi, I am just always cognizant of our responsibility as Ahmadis – the first step of tabligh is our conduct/actions. It would be a shame if the response they gave to a hate-monger was, “Yeah I knew an Ahmadi at uni once, he/she just hung around in their own AMSAs and didn’t really speak to us.”

    In summary, I believe yes we should desist from befriending anyone who incessantly speaks foul of any religion in an inappropriate manner, but we should not let their actions dictate ours. Once we have taken steps to protect ourselves from being misguided, we should focus on the bigger job in hand of spreading the love. And I think love should not be like rubbing two hands together vigorously to keep you warm from the outside, but rather that sip of hotdrink that spreads the warmth from the inside.

    PS: Thank you ‘ahmadisister’ for your post on Riba.

  2. Imam Ghazali, Mujjadid wa Hujjah al-Islam (rahmatAllahu ‘alayh) wrote that:

    “those who rush to condemn people who go against any school as Unbelievers are reckless ignoramuses. For, how could the jurist, purely on the basis of his mastery of Islamic law (fiqh), assume this enormous task? In what branch of the law does he encounter the (aforementioned) skills and sciences? So when you see the jurist who knows nothing but law plunging into matters of branding people Unbelievers or condemning them as misguided, turn away from him and occupy neither your heart nor your tongue with him. For, challenging others with one’s knowledge is a deeply ingrained human instinct over which the ignorant are able to exercise no control”

    (pg. 120 of his “Faysal al-Tafriqa Bayna al-Islam wa al-Zandaqa”, or “The Decisive Criterion for Distinguishing Islam from Masked Infidelity”)

    In terms of modern ‘Ulemah, King Abdullah II sent the following three questions to 24 of the most senior religious scholars from all around the world representing all the branches and schools of Islam: (1) Who is a Muslim? (2) Is it permissible to declare someone an apostate (takfir)? (3) Who has the right to undertake issuing fatwas (legal rulings)?

    Based on the fatwas provided by these great scholars (who included the Shaykh al-Azhar; Ayatollah Sistani and Sheikh Qaradawi), in July 2005 CE, H.M. King Abdullah II convened an international Islamic conference of 200 of the world’s leading Islamic scholars ‘Ulama) from 50 countries. In Amman, the scholars unanimously issued a ruling on three fundamental issues (which became known as the ‘Three Points of the Amman Message’):

    1. They specifically recognized the validity of all 8 Madhahib (legal schools) of Sunni, Shi’a and ‘Ibadhi Islam; of traditional Islamic Theology (Ash’arism); of Islamic Mysticism (Sufism), and of true Salafi thought, and came to a precise definition of who is a Muslim.

    2. Based upon this definition they forbade takfir (declarations of apostasy) between Muslims.

    3. Based upon the Madhahib they set forth the subjective and objective preconditions for the issuing of fatwas, thereby exposing ignorant and illegitimate edicts in the name of Islam.

    http://ammanmessage.com/

    I think maybe someone should write an article on the un-Islamic practise of Takfir (calling others claiming to be Muslims as non-Muslims) and why it is haraam according to the Qur’an, Ahadith, Practise of the Sahabah al-Kareem, Practise/Saying of the Khulafah al-Rashideen, Writings/Sayings of the Classical Scholars/Saints, Writings of the Imam Mahdi (‘alayhi al-salam), and Writings/Sayings of the Khulafah al-Masiheen.

  3. MashaAllah. A very passionate reply Haseeb. How is Canada? Do tell Khuddam in Canada about this website.
    This website is a store-house of knowledge for the youth embowering and equipping them with the armour to engage in the Jihad of the Pen.

  4. Jazak Allah Khayr al-Jazaa brother. May Almighty Allah bless you. I agree completely with what you have written. The hadith is clear that if someone calls another a kafir then one of the two will be determined as a kafir. In this case we believe that Hadrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (‘alayhi al-salam) was the Imam al-Mahdi and Promised Messiah who reached the station of Zilli Nabuwwat – put simply, he was a great man of God and it is not possible for such a person to be a kafir. Therefore, anyone who calls him a kafir is tredding on very dangerous ground. As an Ahmadi I could not care less if someone called me a kafir, but to sit quietly while someone calls our Imam (‘alayhi al-salam) a kafir is just too much for the heart to take. People often do not understand that it is this very agitation which stirs up so much passion in the hearts of people like Haseeb Sahib, indeed all of the people who contribute towards this blog, who is in love with the Imam of the Age (‘alayhi al-salam).

    May Almight Allah bless you Haseeb Sahib.

  5. It is true that the word is very heavy. But I was merely mentioning that those who are so against the Jamaat that they vilify Masih-e-Maud (as) calling him a kafir, Dajjal, liar, etc., then they are bringing kufr upon themselves. This is what I mean. It is very clearly stated in Sahih Bukhari:

    Narrated Abu Huraira: Allah’s Apostle said, “If a man says to his brother, O kafir (disbeliever)!’ Then surely one of them is such (i.e., a Kifir). ” (Book #73, Hadith #125)

    So anyone who says that to Masih-e-Maud (as) and spreads that to others and gets them to say it has gone very wrong. What I said may sound harsh, but it is the statement of the Holy Prophet (saw). Your editing of my words DOES convey my meaning better. So I thank you for that. Perhaps I just wrote it wrong. But the meaning I intended is based upon this Hadith here. No fatwa is better than the one which the Holy Prophet (saw) said himself. Also, when someone curses another, then those curses backfire when they are undeserved. From my understanding, no curse as vile as the ones which are mentioned by those such as on the cult forum are more deserving of backfiring. I am indeed passionate about this because for anyone from thecult reading this, I hope they will investigate the Ahadith and learn for themselves that cursing is no small matter. they bring it upon themselves that Allah will cause their curses to ruin them instead.

    I apologize to anyone if what I said sounded rude. But I was merely making the point that curses backfire. Rejection of a Prophet of Allah is a very serious matter, and yet in the case of Masih-e-Maud (as) it is treated as a small matter. Whoever is called false prophet, I do not think any one of them is cursed more through other people’s tongues than Masih-e-Maud (as) is. That should be food for thought that the rejection of him is pretty high. It only proves his truthfulness even more though. I hope many of you out there realize this as it is evident from the Holy Quran that all past prophets were mocked. It is no laughing matter. I just wish to express how grave of an error it is.

  6. Assalam Alaikum

    In an ideal Islamic society especially intellectually based within our great university institutes the true followers of Islamic teachings would follow the guidelines of mutual understanding and dialogue for beliefs.

    It is unfortunate that in 99 % of the time when an Ahmadi attends an Islamic society event or openly looks to participate it is not accepted with a loving approach but on many occasion with resentment and lack of understanding. The basic principles of the foundation of Islam don’t seem to matter. Hatred becomes widespread and educational inter dialogue is replaced with separation and in some occasions violence. All key points which are unislamic.

    If there is an environment of mutual respect and Love that could rise above differences and understanding and look to educate each other and each one of us has our own thoughts and decisions to make on what we do in our lives and to progress ourselves spiritually in rightousness and respect this is a true Islamic Society.

  7. AA

    This is similar to Pakistan’s National Database & Registration Authority (NADRA) the have this initiative of ID cards for it’s citezens and for Overseas Pakistanis there is the NICOP card, which identifies one as a legitimate citizen of Pakistan and therefore, under the protection of Pakistan. In the application form one has to fill a section indicating which religion one is; it specifically states Muslim and Ahmadi Muslim separately, one may argue that this is for safety of Ahmadi Muslims. http://www.nadra.gov.pk/images/docs2/NICOP2.pdf

    However, if you wish to apply for a Pakistani passport and an ID card you have to sign an oath :
    “I consider Mirza Ghulam Ahmad an impostor prophet. And also consider his followers, whether belonging to the Lahori or Qadiani group, to be non-Muslims.” http://www.thepersecution.org/archive/pl_xpass.html

    What is the need for this oath?

    Wasalaam

  8. In Pakistan Ahmadis are feeling the heat more than ever before. In Pakistan 10 more Ahmadi students have been expelled from school on basis of being Ahmadis. http://tribune.com.pk/story/269390/ahmadis-expelled-from-school/

    I would go on to say that 10 potential Nobel Prize winners have now been deprived of education! Don’t they understand that Dr Abdus Salam, an Ahmadi was the most successful educated man of Pakistan and all Ahmadis strive in his footsteps. Now Mullah junta is closing all doors for more Salams to rise.

    And to cap it off, a new system for roll number slips for students has been introduced by the Govt where religion is displayed on it. If this isn’t the worst form of religious discrimination then what is. Where does Islam say that education is prerogative of a select few!

    And when I thought Pakistan cannot go much lower – it reveals another pit of darkness in which it jumps with disgusting fervour.

  9. If you have a specific subject you want to discuss then a new page can be set up for that. As far as I know, the main issues that have been discussed are (1) The age of the Promised Messiah (‘alayhi al-salam), (2) the eclipse, and (3) The Muhammadi Begum issue. Each of these already have an independent page. Perhaps this page should be reserved from now on to only issues relating to University.

  10. Brother / sister, I am not the keeper of the readers on this blog and they are free to do as they wish. I only said that I will not be moving across to a forum, particularly the Cult. That is my advise to the readers here too. The Al-Huda forum is there and free for all to use as a forum. I have found it to be a useful place and do advise anyone who wants to investigate certain issues further to go there: http://rahehuda.mta.tv/index.php?option=com_kunena&view=listcat&catid=28&Itemid=102

  11. And there are several topics being discussed here which adds to the confusion. A forum would allow each topic to be discussed properly.

  12. Yes, but this format is very confusing, I’m having a hard time finding posts. A forum is much clearer and easier to use. These kind of discussions can get very long and it will only get more confusing. If you don’t wish to discuss at thecult, then maybe you could set up your own forum. Or ask the admin if he would like to set up one.

  13. Again with this fallacy of majority? (yes that is a philosophical fallacy, look it up).

    The majority at one time believed the world was flat. Just because the majority believe something doesn’t make it true. And the “majority” are disunited and have divergent ideologies. There is no one body of Muslims with the exact same views. It’s not a pan with all the same eggs, it’s more like many pans with many eggs all calling themselves “the majority”.

    The Prophet Seyyidina Muhammad (sallAllahu ‘alayhi wa sallam) also said that “if there is not a Khalifah of Islam among you, then go and hide behind a tree until there is one, and do not stick to majority.” (Paraphrasing with emphasis added).

    And I don’t know if you’ve seen the saint Seyyidina Ibn al-‘Arabi’s (rahmatAllahu ‘alayh) Kitab al-Mahdi? This is what he says in it:

    “He (the Mahdi) will eliminate the different schools (of religious law) so that only the Pure Religion (Qur’an 39:3) remains, and his enemies will be those who follow blindly the ‘ulama’, the people of ijtihad, because they will see the Mahdi judging differently from the way followed by their imams (i.e., the historical founders of the schools of Islamic law).”

    He says the “Enemies of the Mahdi” are those who choose to engage in Taqlid and blindly follow the ‘Ulemah of the time because they think they judge the right way due to their being the “majority” and that the Ahmadiyyah position (the Jama’ah of the Mahdi) is different from their schools of thought.

    So according to this criterion, you my friend, are an “Enemy of the Mahdi”. How would it feel being known to God with that title?

  14. Assalamu ‘Alaikum brother. Firstly, I am so happy to see you commenting and making several important points. I apologise in advance as I edited some of your post. I do understand your passion and position, but I think it is best to talk about the vile anti-Ahmadis in the same terms and language that our beloved Hudur (ayyadahu Allahu ta’ala bi-nasrihi al-‘aziz) does. My humble advice to you is that if you do wish to use the word kafir for any other person then please do so through an established quotation of anyone with the authority to issue a fatwa of kufr. It is a very heavy word. I pray that my words have not upset you and that you forgive me if that is the case. Please do keep commenting and sharing your views with us. Jazak Allah Khayr al-Jazaa’.

    I have posted the response of Hadrat Khalifatul Masih IV (rahmat Allah ‘alayhi on this here.

  15. Exactly. Isa (as) was reported in the Bible to have mixed with the criminals and lowlifes, but he did that to reform them so that they would discontinue their evil ways. But, I disagree that everyone should do that. People of lower spiritual level should not do that. I know of some Muslims who have left Islam because they did that. They did not know about Islam and were not close with Allah and so they lost their way. Only Allah is a guide. If you are guided, then you can try and guide others. Certainty of faith is important. You cannot possibly debate an atheist (for example) and think that you can get them to believe in Allah when you do not have a personal connection with Allah and say that you believe in Allah because you were raised that way. Rationality alone does not lead one to the truth. This is why the Holy Quran repeatedly says, “Allah guides” – not people. You do not discover God through nature. you discover Him through Him. As Sufi as that sounds, the Sufis are the only ones right in knowing how to know Allah. I have learned a lot from their works. Masih-e-Maud (as) prescribed the EXACT same method.

  16. Again with the sticking to the majority? I think you are thinking of the Hadith which says that [paraphrasing, not exact words, recalling from memory], ‘my Ummah will not all agree on an error’. What I got from that is that not all of the Muslim Ummah will at any point in time between his (saw)’s time and the Day of Judgement be in error. That is what I take from it. It is very widely misunderstood that this means that the majority of the Ummah is always right. If population was a factor of truthfulness, then none of the Prophets would have prevailed. I find it highly doubtful that the majority is correct. Who is the majority? State a Hadith which proves this.

  17. Cylindrical

    As you would have seen that this blog is the best place for such a discussion as we all try to be polite and sincere with each other. I’m sure if you posted your beliefs any scrutinisation of them will not be vindictive but will be only to show you how we differ or agree. We are always happy to present our views and open them up to scrutinisation and criticism because we are confident in their foundations. I think it’s fair that others should also this method because at the end of the day we’re all looking for Allah and that takes precedence over winning an arguement.

    On thecult site if we present a disagreeable idea we are always shouted down, that doesn’t happen here. Hence if you are prepared to tell us about your beliefs (with permission of the blog owner) then please present them here.

  18. I disagree. There are many Ahadith on Imam Mahdi (as). Read “The Heavenly Sign” (Nishan-e-Asmani) by Masih-e-Maud (as). he explains the concept of Imam Mahdi (as) in that book. He explains the confusions surrounding the concept of it. Go to http://www.alislam.org and you will find the information there and go to the Library link, since that will lead you to the books you want to read. The best thing is to go to the source. I myself and everyone else here will not be able to explain everything as well as they are explained in the original sources themselves.

  19. Look at the BBC news archive about the leaflets. Here is a link about it which I found about those on the website:
    http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-15021073
    It said that the Stockwell Mosque did it and was accused of terror. Rightly so. They even gave their contact information. If this link does not work for some reason, then go to http://www.bbc.com, and type in the search box on the top right corner [Ahmadi boycott], that is, without typing the brackets. Type what is inside the brackets.
    And you make it sound as if cult is even always a bad thing. Every religion has a start in which it is known as a cult. Ahmadiyyat is not a separate religion. It is Islam. It is a movement within Islam started by Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as). Ahmadiyyat is the truth. I ask what are you afraid of? I read your response on here and found that you did not even research the bbc website which took me no more than around 3 minutes to do. I think you are hiding from the truth and not facing up to it. And what I just said states that. you are too afraid to research.

    Go to http://www.alislam.org to learn about Islam revived. Masih-e-Maud (as) came as the Hakam, who removes differences. Remove all differences and embrace the pure submission to Allah which is required.

  20. This is very true. I don’t have experience with people in my everyday life, but on forums I have had this exact same experience. I would write things straight from the Holy Quran and Ahadith, and even though many Muslims were hostile to views from the Quran and Ahadith against their popular opinion and sentiments, they did not attack me as an individual. But, when I defended some remarks about Masih-e-Maud (as), then I was attacked and removed from the forum after arguing on the forum for about an hour. This was Ummah Forums by the way.

    So, in essence I don’t view non-Ahmadi Muslims as being different. But when I encounter some of them who are like this, then I realize that they are different. I thank Allah when I see that that I am not one of them. They resort to such low attacks. Any why not? Its a tarbiyyat issue. When people rely on the maulvis for spiritual guidance and all they get is trash, then they spew trash at those who stand for the Holy Quran and the blessed sayings of the Holy Prophet (saw). I condemn every Muslim who takes on such a vulgar tone against Masih-e-Maud (as) because they are also going against the Holy Prophet Muhammad (saw). So I don’t think anyone who says ‘la’anatullah’ to Masih-e-Maud (as) should be called ‘Muslim’ sometimes. They are truly [moving towards disbelief] when they reject him. [deleted] Because when it comes down to it, they certainly [take on the traits of the worst disbelievers] when it comes to rejecting him. Not all of them, but those who have taken on the same darkness as those who were originally against Masih-e-Maud (as) – because this filth has been continually propagating through the generations due to their evil books and speeches. They are certainly causing harm to Islam.

    Yes this sounds harsh, but remember that maulvis who are against Masih-e-Maud (as) are our enemies because they use all means to try and destroy Ahmadis, from slander to killing. Why should they ever be treated as friends? They are not our friends, and those who accept what they say are not our friends either. Anyone who thinks those maulvis who slander Masih-e-Maud (as) are righteous are many. Sheikh Abdullah bin Baaz is one of those who was part of those fatwas. Many Muslims listen to them. Online the website with fatwas called http://www.islam-qa.com is often quoted and propagated. Has anyone of you ever seen the filth they wrote against the Jamaat? It is absolutely offensive, as they have used many lies against the Jamaat. These same scholars are the ones who many non-Ahmadi Muslims listen to. When such scholars are considered righteous by someone, then first try and see if they really follow these maulvis. If they do not accept everything they say and follow more strictly to the Holy Quran, then they are good as friends. But if they take the same stance and word-for-word denounce Masih-e-Maud (as) as they do, then they should not be befriended.

    This is why we do not pray behind non-Ahmadi Muslims. When they take on the dark color of the maulvis who rejected the Masih-e-Maud (as), then they are [moving towards disbelief] because they have rejected a Prophet of Allah. There is a reason why Allah has called Masih-e-Maud (as) Nabi and Rasul – because he was of that status, and rejecting him is as bad as rejecting any other Prophet of Allah. Allah gave such revelations for a reason. Anyone who rejects him, is essentially [moving towards a position of disbelief] for the most part. If we are looked down on by them for that, then so be it. For they are committing a grave error. I say help them understand Ahmadiyyat and show them it is the true Islam, and if they do not listen, then turn away from them.

  21. You are welcome to take any discussion you like to the Cult site. I will not be following you there and I sincerely advise everyone else to also avoid going there. Each person that chooses to post on this blog has demonstrated (except for Rationalist) a level of respect and dignity which is praiseworthy. To post on the Cult, or even have an association with it, is, for me, not befitting of a Muslim with any notion of what adab (Islamic etiquette) is. One should be very careful as to what they attach themselves to. Not because of me or any other human watching on, but because we all face our Lord one day and I believe that the gossip on that site is contrary to the laws of the Almighty.

  22. A comments section is inappropriate for these type of discussions. I suggest we take this discussion to thecult or any other forum you wish to. Not Rah e Huda though, the moderation there is ridiculous.

  23. Pingback: “A Nation Cannot be Reformed Without First Reforming its Youth …

  24. Pingback: “A Nation Cannot be Reformed Without First Reforming its Youth” | Demystifying the Cult

  25. Assalamo alaikum
    Its great to read everyones comments, both for and against.
    I belive its important we engage respectfully as everyone has done and avoid an “holier than thou” attitude.
    Thank you for everyones input, it is always a joy to follow

  26. Also, the other flaw with their argument of “come to the majority that believes in no more prophets,” is that Jesus (as) – when he returns according to them – will STILL be a prophet!

    So thus, they want us to do these verbal gymnastics to believe Jesus (as) doesn’t “violate” finality because he was born before but didn’t die and will die last but somehow isn’t the last prophet, never mind the 2000+ years he was somehow alive in an evidently physical place called heaven.

    You want to talk fantasy beliefs – THAT is a fantasy belief.

    It really boils down to one of two things:

    1.) Muslims who believe in the Messiah, Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as), believe that Allah raised a Muslim to the level of a subordinate prophet because that Muslim loved the Master Holy Prophet (sa) so much that his (sa) teachings helped elevate someone form his (sa) own ummah to prophethood, to revive the Muslims and unite them with peace and love.

    2. Muslims who reject Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as) believe that not a single Muslim is capable of being blessed by the teachings of the Master Prophet (sa), and therefore, Allah will have to send a Prophet from the Children of Israel (as the Qur’an calls him) to save the Muslims, who are incapable of learning from the example of the Master Prophet (sa). Instead, Jesus (as) is needed because he learned from a lesser Prophet than Prophet Muhammad (sa), i.e. Prophet Moses. (as).

    And they say we offend the Holy Prophet (sa)?

  27. For the record, I would like to state that Blackburn, a town in the North of England, is a very respectable place situated in the heart of the Lancashire countryside.I’m sure all of those living their have their hands intact (or they did the last time I was there, which was some years ago)..

  28. They love using the old Follow the sunnah line and you cant go wrong. Erm isnt every division of Islam following the Sunnah, so question is where did it go so so wrong? (Opponents will be like, whats gone wrong? Besides a few wars, islamaphobia, civil war, radicalisation, westernisation and the hot topic of are prawns halal or not, its all rosy here.)

    Unfortunately the Opponent ‘type’ not all muslims, but the angry ones live in a certain bubble, consumed in a vacuum of hate in the one thing that really unites them, Ahmadiyyat. When a few of them do wake up in the realisation that perhaps Muslims do need leadership and guidance like any Human being does, I hope they do one thing, concentrate on there own community and leaders. Be careful of the whole slander and gossip angle you guys love, brothers can get hands chopped for that talk. (joke, i know im just stereotyping, unless you from Blackburn!)

  29. I’m glad that you finally answered some questions yourself. These discussions should be a two way thing where we try to learn from each others qualities.

    You have suggested that I stereotyped the whole Ummah. That is totally incorrect. Anyone in their right mind knows that every Muslim does not do the things I referred to but there are pockets out there that do…I gave the example of the Taliban as one example. Clearly not everyone follows the Taliban. I was merely trying to find out what you personally believe and follow because so far you have been so consumed with pointing out the weaknesses of the Ahmadiyya doctrine without letting on what you believe in as a better alternative.

    You say we only need follow the Quran and Sunnah which I agree with, however my question is who have you learnt the Quran and Sunnah from…surely we all need a teacher? How many teachers do you know that are not attached to one group or another? If you say we can learn from the classical scholars, then I must remind you that most if not all of them followed a certain school of thought and group…please inform us if it is not required to follow any group in Islam, then what can the classical scholars teach us if they did not know this very basic ‘fact’?

    You have quoted a hadith that suggests we must follow the majority.there is another well known Hadith that ‘those who fail to recognise the imam of the age dies a death of ignorance’…who is your imam? If you say you have none, then do you admit you are currently amongst the ignorant? Is that what you are calling us to?

    Look, all I’m trying to get at is that you say our beliefs are flawed, fine. You and I both know we will have to agree to disagree, but all you seem to do is tell us how we are wrong but never show us how your own beliefs are superior. Say I accept everything you tell me and want to join you, can you tell me about Isa ibn Maryam (as) and how will I recognise him when he and the Imam Mahdi (as) comes?…will the majority of the Ummah be on their side? If not then how can we recognise them? What is the correct concept of Dajjal we must follow because I see a lot dajjali activities happening in the world today, especially against the Ummah…how do I recognise the Daajal when it arrives?

    These are just two of the most important questions I have, I can present many more. If you are right in your beliefs, then you must have satisfying answers to these questions. What I and I’m sure others on this blog would like to see is your presentation of the right beliefs so that we may correct ourselves if indeed we are wrong…you may even start a new thread on each topic. I’m sure our editor will allow it as long as you are civil in your approach.

    This is a sincere invitation. If you have the answers to our questions then it is your duty to guide us, that is all I’m saying.

  30. Regarding your riba comment, I thought I might bring to your attention, that in fact the non-ahmadi scholars and shuyukh allow interest. (surprised?)
    It is well known that the late Sheikh Tantawi, Shaykh al-Azhar, had issued his opinion about the permissibility of bank interest as a Mufti of Egypt after which he was elevated to the post of Sheikh of Al-Azhar.

    I can provide you with many many quotes and fatawa from Muslim scholars who have allowed the permissibility of riba-based transactions as have the fatwa council based on the concept of daroora. So why does it become an “Ahmadiyya” issue when based on that daroora principle. I think if you studied the Shariah, its maqasid and its rules, you would not come out with such ridiculous statements. The fatawa of the European Council for Fatwa and research state:

    “The problem of housing is pandemic. The council reiterates the prohibition of usury in the Qur’an and that Muslims must find viable alternatives to the problem of house buying. When no viable alternative exists, a Muslim is permitted to buy a house with a conventional mortgage, with the proviso that he is not already a home-owner. The second proviso is that he is not able to purchase it in cash.” Here is the crux of the matter:

    “The basis for this verdict is the legal maxim “necessity permits the prohibited (Q.119), and the maxim “a need is tantamount to a necessity when it is pandemic. the fatwa is further premised on the position of the Hanafi school regarding usury. This is since a Muslim is tasked only with ordering his private affairs when a citizen of a non-Muslim state; he is not required to establish civil, political or economic legislation. Furthermore, renting is dis-empowering whereas Islam aims at the empowerment of a Muslim, materially a well as spiritually” Fatwa 26, Session 2.

    One thing: It is a current theme that I often see: Whenever our beloved Khalifa says anything, non-ahmadis jump at the chance to label him (and us) as kafirs who are going against the Qur’an. But when the non-ahmadis are saying the similar things, everything is hunky dory and they are following on the right path. Ironic, isn’t it? With regards to the interest you are talking about, that does not come into play here as you don’t know what it refers to or means or where it went. You just took a figure off of a line and then spun your own line. If it concerns you that much, write to the Jama’at and ask the question.

    Wassalaam

  31. Cylindric:
    The hadith is:

    Imam Ali bin Umar Dar-e-Qutni states in his collection of ahadith:

    My Ustaad Abu Saeed Istakhri narrates from his Ustaad Muhammad bin Abdullah, who narrates from his Ustaad Ubaid bin Ya’eesh, and he narrates from Yunus bin Bukair, and he from Amar bin Shamir, and he from Jaabir who narrates that Muhammad bin Ali said:
    Verily, for our Mahdi there are two signs which have never as yet concurred since the creation of the heavens and earth; first is the eclipse of the moon on the first night of Ramadan, and second is the eclipse of the sun during the middle of that same Ramadan. This (concurrence of a solar and lunar eclipse) has never happened since Allah created the heavens and earth. (Dar-e-Qutni vol.2 p.65).

  32. I used to read it for the theological discussions and viewpoints but ironically my interest waivered around the same time the news of the world collapsed.

  33. The problem with this is that opponents of the jamaat simply say ‘we’re not inviting you to a sect per se, we’re inviting you to the ‘real Islam’ yadda yadda yadda…essentially, they don’t actually have anything to invite us to, they’ll just be happy as long as we leave Ahmadiyyat.

  34. AA

    No I am not confusing the two organisations, the Academy is the “British wing of Khatme Nubbawat” http://www.icsr.info/blog/Channel-4-Investigates-Anti-Ahmadi-Sentiment-in-the-UK.
    Personally I think you are dancing around the real issues here, if you want to turn a blind eye to what is going on in the world that’s your prerogative. But don’t label us Ahmadi Muslims as a “deceptive organisation”. There is NO anti-Muslim slander in our Jamaat , that’s just your paranoia.

    The CPS may have settle the matter of this particular leaflet however, countless debates have been raised in relation to the persecution of the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community in the UK and abroad. This debate was raise in the House of Commons in 2010, in light of these events. You can read the debate here : http://www.publications.parliament.uk/pa/cm201011/cmhansrd/cm101020/halltext/101020h0001.htm

    You won’t agree with me or anyone here as you came here with your mind made up and that’s a really sad thing to see. I will continue to pray for you.

    Wasalaam

  35. I’m curious, what is the “Majority” to which non-Ahmadi Muslims invite us? There are literally hundreds of sects of Islam. We are the only sect that is founded on the belief that Imam Mahdi and Messih (as) has come in the person of Syedna Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (as). So why not hold fast to the rope of Allah and follow His(swt) Prophet that he(sa) foretold?

    If the majority is “Muslims who believe that no more Prophets can come,” well that’s just counter-intuitive right? That doesn’t solve anything. Prophethood is a blessing and mercy of Allah (4:70), and to think that Allah’s blessings have ceased is not only unIslamic, but outright shirk. Man dares put his faith in himself rather than in Allah?Astaghfurullah.

    But really, what “Majority” do they invite us to. I wonder? Here’s a great video by anti-Ahmadi mullah Tahir ul Qadri who proves this point. He openly admits that Muslims as a whole are completely disunited with no identity whatsoever: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zshzeJEQCy8

    Is this the Islam we’re invited to? No thanks.

    Instead, I’ll stick to the Imam Mahdi and Messih (as) per the instructions of my beloved Master Prophet Al Khatam an Nabiyyeen Syedna Hazrat Muhammad Mustafa (sa).

  36. If you have any other queries then by all means let admin know. As far as I can tell in terms of the original article and the subsequent responses it should be clear why some Lajna members advised caution when frequenting University ISOC.

    In terms of the leaflet issue personally I am aware and was made aware at University by people I knew that they indeed felt Ahmadi Muslims were Kafir and worthy of death. This cannot be a singular occurrence. Many people in this country may feel the same way so this sentiment exists. In Pakistan It is open in this country it is hidden because of fear of the law. I haven’t seen “the” leaflet but I have no reason except conjecture to assume the girl involved was lying. Furthermore in view of the “kill Ahamdis” sentiment being so rife in places like Pakistan, Indonesia etc its unlikely sentiments here are radically different only
    they are not openly expressed due to the law of the land. As already stated I have heard it said. Having said that you may not agree with any of these people or sentiments and consider them unislamic which is wonderful, but please don’t patronise us when people have been martyred in Pakistan and Indonesia by saying we bring evidence of hat crimes against Ahmadi Muslims.

    Salam

  37. “Can you please categorically tell us if you believe that Ahmadis are ‘Wajibul Qatl’ i.e. necessary to be killed? ”

    No, I don’t, just like the majority of Muslims.

    “Tell us, would you lock up women in their houses and beat them if they left the house alone like the Taliban? Jamaat Ahmadiyya doesn’t do that anywhere in the world!”

    This is a hateful stereotype, usually found in right wing media. No surprise that an Ahmadi is making the same accusation. No, I don’t believe in beating woman. That is against the teachings of our Rasulullah (SAW).

    “Would you beat the ankles of those praying if they don’t happen to wear their trousers high enough? Jamaat Ahmadiyya doesn’t do that anywhere in the world!”

    I don’t know of any Muslims doing that… again hateful stereotypes.

    “Or do you think we are completely bonkers for not falling in prostration at the graves of some of the great Aulia of Islam?”

    Your lack of knowledge regarding the Ummah is shockng. This shirk is only committed in certain communities in Pakistan. And Pakistan is not the whole Muslim world.

    “Are you a Brelvi, Wahhabi, Deobandi? Should we also follow your Aqida? By they way, what is it that you want us believe?”

    Unlke in Ahmadiyya, there is no obligation in Islam to be part of any group. You should follow Quran and Sunnah. That is enough. What you shouldn’t do is follow a false prophet just because the Ummah is in trouble. Stick to the majority, follow Quran and Sunnah, and you can’t possibly go wrong.

    Allow me to share this hadith:

    Ibn Umar (Allah be pleased with him) reported Allah’s Messenger (Peace be upon him) as saying:

    “Follow the great mass (as-Sawad al-Azam) for he who kept himself away from it, in fact would be thrown in Hell Fire.” (Ibn Majah; vide: Mishkat, 1/174, by A.H. Siddiqui).

    May Allah (SWT) guide you to Islam.

  38. The vast majority of points made at thecult and other websites are valid points. If you cannot islamically justify the actions of your leaders and your founder, then you should ask yourself if you really are following Islam.

  39. Ahmadi Muslimah, you are confusing two organisations here.

    The appalling leaflet calling for the murder of Ahmadis in Pakistan was distributed by the Khatme Nabuwwat organisation there. The leaflet titled “Deception of the Qadiyani” was distributed by the Khatme Nabuwwat Academy in London. These are two separate organisations.

    And frankly, I don’t see anything wrong with that leaflet. It informs Muslims of your beliefs and your media outlets and warns us to be careful. What is so hateful about that? In our eyes Ahmadiyya is of course a deceptive organisation.

    Anti-Muslim slander is rife in Ahmadiyya, this leaflet saga being one example. There is no leaflet being distributed in London calling for the murder of Ahmadis. Period. The Kingston police confirmed that and so did the Crown Prosecution Service.

  40. Cylindrical, much respect to you for coming and sharing your points as I’d rather you be up front then engaging in the front/back under and over biting that happens on the cult. However please appriciate that the sister cant read your mind and answer all your allegations in one post. chances are if you found the ones see listed debatable then your sure to find the ones missed out debatable to. Only thing I say is, show some love man and appriciate that she has made the effort to respond to your query. You need to let go of the hate bro i sense in you, can only lead to suffering as a wise Jedi once said. Hope inshallah all Muslims in general can learn to accept differences and be civil with one another. Wishful thinking I know.

  41. Someone should translate this for the benefit of everyone…it clear says Ahmadis should be shot in the street in order to serve Islam…if I had a bit more time over next few days I’d do it myself

  42. Cylindrical,

    Once again you’ve responded to everything else except the questions directed specifically at you and about your beliefs…why don’t you want to tell us what your Aqida is? You expect us to always defend our position but never allow us to question yours. What are you afraid of?

  43. AA
    In my personal opinion, as an Ahmadi, in exceptional situations, I may dive and dip in the pond like the bird that preys fish..but out from pond, when I am on the branch of the tree, I must be free from any sign of water drops on my body like the bird. When somebody asked Luqman, the great Hakim, how come he became so wise? He replied that he mingled with wrong elements of society. He tried to investigate deeply, why these people are called by others as to be bad and wicked in the society. He pondered over their negative actions, which earned them bad names and gradually started removing those bad things from actions of his own daily life….and gradually became a gentle man and wise great Hakim. Some others make the opinion that a man is recognized by the companions he keeps. Anyhow…the generalized instruction as per Qur’an must be honored, which says : KUNU MA’AS’SADIQEEN….
    And we all know that :
    KUNAND HAM JINS MA HAMJINS PARWAZ,
    KABUTAR BA KABUTAR…. BAAZ BA BAAZ.
    i.e….Birds of same feather flock together…..If an Ahmadi dares mix and mingle with somebody, he must try to color his mate in the color with which he has been graced by Allah and the reverse should not happen….i.e….he himself should not get colored in the color of his mate…
    I don’t recommend DO AT ROME AS ROMANS DO….rather, I recommend WHY LET ROME AS ROMANS DO ???
    Anyhow the Post/Article is commendable and has been prepared with great sincerity…JazakAllah.

  44. AA
    A short video on the hate crimes against Ahmadiyya Muslim Community: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-11947734

    Now from the horses mouth:

    The leaflet : http://www.khatmenubuwwat.org/leaflets/dhoka_leaflet_english.pdf

    http://www.khatmenubuwwat.org/leaflets/mta_tv_eng.pdf

    This is not very friendly, we don’t send out anti-sunni /shia…material.
    So, you say this says nothing about killing. The same group Khatm-e-nubuwwat distributed a set of hate leaflets in Pakistan this year.

    So, would the same organisation print different leaflets for different regions? Sure, the “ kill Ahmadi” leaflet wasn’t found here but it was found in Pakistan, where they know that the law protects them under: “PPC 298C – Aka Ordinance XX: An Ahmadi, calling himself a Muslim, or preaching or propagating his faith, or outraging the religious feelings of Muslims, or posing himself as a Muslim. The Penalty 3 years imprisonment and fine.”

    It seem like they love going to Pakistan to spread hate, this time in Rabwah: pretty threatening behaviour. http://www.rabwah.net/rabwah-set-for-international-khatme-nabuwat-conference/

    Here are the leaflets distributed in Pakistan http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-london-15021073

    I guess you still need more proof; the car is right infront of you, get in. Yet you still want to proceed to your destination on foot.

    Good luck on your search I will be praying for you.

  45. You have listed many points that are very debatable. But you have ignored the majority of ahadith relating directly to the Imam Mahdi. You have also ignored Mirza Ghulam Ahmad’s failed prophecies (Pigott, his death in Mekka or Medina etc.). I urge you to study those.

  46. I need evidence, not assumptions. Unless you can show me the leaflet the young lady was talking about, she is guilty of slandering the enitre Muslim community in London.

    From the Wimbledon Guardian:

    “A teenage Ahmadi girl, who did not want to be named, gave police a statement claiming the leaflet, which she said was written in Urdu, said: “Kill a Qadiyani [Ahmadiyya] and doors to heaven will be open to you”.

    Kingston police later said it had never been handed the leaflet and has not received any other allegations. ”

    http://www.wimbledonguardian.co.uk/news/ahmadiyya/8755032.Meeting_between_Ahmadiyya_Community_and_Tooting_Islamic_Centre_ends_in_silence/

    I can’t read the leaflet in the first link, but as far as I remember it warned Muslims of Ahmadiyya theology and didn’t call for the murder of Ahmadis at all.

  47. AA

    It’s so good to hear/read this, I have noticed that there is a higher level of religious tolerance in places like Canada and America. Take the Muslims for Life campaign http://muslimsforlife.org for example, I was reading through the partners working along side the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community and I was surprised to see the American Islamic Congress. (I am assuming they have similarities with the Muslim Council of Britain).
    I have never seen the Muslim Council of Britain support our campaigns in the UK or maybe I have missed something?
    Wasalaam

  48. I believe that it was Rationalist who made that comment and was subsequently asked by me not to comment here again. He posted under the name: ”Knight.” I am not sure who Cylindrical is, though he could be Rationalist.

  49. Salam

    Like pretty much every allegation raised by the non-Ahmadi Muslims can be brought back to themselves. I was in Kingston Uni between 2000 and 2004, and joined quite a few other religious societies; and went to pretty much all the Christian Union weekly Bible talks, along with a few Sikh and Hindu society talks. And the looks of astonishment that a Muslim has come to their event was so obvious. Thus proving that fact that I was pretty much the only Muslim who had ever bothered coming to and joining their societies, and in all my time there, I have never seen a member of the ISOC come.

    Jazak Allah

    Mashhood

  50. Cylindrical said :- “May Allah (SWT) guide you to Islam”

    Make up your mind sir, I seem to recall another post of yours recently in which you were threatening us with death. Now you seem to wish for our guidance. Can you make up your mind please?

  51. This brings to mind the response given to those by Hadhrat Sahibzada Abdul Lateef Shaheed (RA) when they advised him to conceal his belief from Ameer of Kabul “You seem to have two gods. You seem to fear the Ameer to the extent to which one should fear God only. Would it be proper for me to disobey God for fear of the Ameer? Should I put aside the Holy Quran or should I completely disregard Hadeeth? I will not deflect even if I am confronted with Hell”.

    So he proved too. Now for the rest of us…including those who are “non ahmadi ahmadis” what do we say to Allah when He questions us…..

  52. AA

    It was you Tweeters that got me interested in this blog! MashaAllah you all made such a big effort in your Tabligh during Ramadhan. The tweets came from the UK, Pakistan, Indonesia, Canada, Germany and America; all united!
    Answering allegations in 140 characters, now thats a toughy!!

    Humbly grateful to all my Brothers and Sisters across the pond!
    Wasalaam

  53. Excellent Mashallah!!

    This blog was need of the time and I’m glad to see Ahmadi Muslims from all over the world participating. Alhamdulillah!!! More power to your pens that others lack….vVctory is ours which is undeniable….

    p.s I was the first one who started visiting this blog and started sharing on social media sites. Today I feel so proud that prayers are heard and answered

    Wasalam

  54. I used to be the leader of my school’s MSA (Muslim Students Association) and they even let me lead Salah al-Jumu’ah. They all knew I was an Ahmadi Muslim.

    Our MSA was very diverse. It contained Sunnis (Hanafi, Maliki, and Shafi’i), Shi’ahs (Ithna ‘Ashariyyah, and Isma’ili [Nizari]), and many non-Muslims even, as well as 2 Ahmadis (myself and one other friend of mine).

    We once held this talk about the Masih al-Dajjal. The Shi’ahs had a representative who presented his views, the Sunnis one for them, and I represented the Ahmadi position on the Dajjal.

    Needless to say, it opened up some of their minds, and after viewing me for an entire year and seeing that I pray and think exactly like a Sunni Muslim in terms of fundamentals of faith, they were a bit less prone to believe I am a Kafir (nau’udhu biAllah) as they were taught.

  55. Very well made point. Enjoyable read. On a real level, as you have stated, what is the way forward, if we are not on it? Simply to say ”Islam” or ”become a Muslim” (as if we do not already have those within us) simply won’t cut mustard. I would love for someone to explain what it is that we should believe, which group we should follow?

    It is easy to take a dig, but the commentors, contributors, tweeters, and readers of this blog have spent an enormous amount of time, both here and elsewhere, answering the questions of others. We deserve answers from them if they are continuing to say that we have none. What should we follow? Which group is the right group? Where is the Imam al-Mahdi? Where is Hadrat Jesus (as)? What is the Dajjal?

    I suspect that such answers will not be forthcoming. And you know what, I kind of like the seat I’m sat in right now. I love my Imam (as), my Khalifa (aba), my Nizam. I’m not alone – you see, people have rather offered their lives than give this diamond up.

  56. Can I just ask, why do people who have a problem with the jama’ah stay a part of it? If you have given up your faith on Islam then why are you running covert “operations” to try to annhialate it (God forbid)?

    There is no compulsion in religion and if you feel this blessed jama’ah is wrong then why be a hypocrite?

    Are you scared of your parents/family/society?

    It is Allah you should be afraid of. May Allah give you hidayah

  57. Cylindrical,

    I don’t know if that leaflet exists or not, but what I do know is that based on my personal experiences with non-Ahmadi Muslims I can believe it to exist. In this very country (UK) when I was younger, perhaps only 16 years old I was standing on a tabligh stall when a decent looking Muslim man walked up and told me that if I was back in his country he and his brothers would have me killed…now tell me, what have you got to say about that? Can you please categorically tell us if you believe that Ahmadis are ‘Wajibul Qatl’ i.e. necessary to be killed? What is your stance on that? You go round saying we don’t respond to your questions, I’d like a few of mine answered by you, after all you claim to be on the right path and know the truth. So please guide us.

    Tell us, would you lock up women in their houses and beat them if they left the house alone like the Taliban? Jamaat Ahmadiyya doesn’t do that anywhere in the world!

    Would you beat the ankles of those praying if they don’t happen to wear their trousers high enough? Jamaat Ahmadiyya doesn’t do that anywhere in the world!

    Or do you think we are completely bonkers for not falling in prostration at the graves of some of the great Aulia of Islam? Jamaat Ahmadiyya doesn’t do that anywhere in the world!

    Are you a Brelvi, Wahhabi, Deobandi? Should we also follow your Aqida? By they way, what is it that you want us believe?

    You and your mates never tell us what you actually believe and what the alternative for us is…in essence, you have a lot of questions, but no answers. So why on earth would we be so foolish to follow a person with no answers.

    I don’t know why I’m bothering to write this, you and your friends are too afraid to get into a real debate about your own beliefs. All you know is that its easier to talk about other people’s beliefs and try to shoot them down, because once you start to open up about yourself, your weaknesses will be exposed to everyone.

  58. Cylindrical.

    Your allegation: The point is that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad is not the Imam Mahdi. He hasn’t fulfilled any of the prophecies from ahadith nor his own prophecies.

    Let us remove this misconception:

    1. He will break the Cross and kill the Swine (Bukhari, 56:102).
    This means that the Messiah would appear at a time where the Christian religion will spread over the world with great vigor. The Promised Messiah’s books are filled with falsifying and defeating Christian arguments. He himself states that “I have come at such a time and age”.

    2. He will be of the Persian Descent (Bukhari, 65:62,1)
    The Promised Messiah (as) can be traced back through his lineage to Mirza Hadi Beg who was of Mughal Descent.

    3. His name will resemble that of the Prophet salAllahu ‘alaihe wa sallam.
    The prophet salAllahu ‘alihe wa sallam had the name Ahmad, and so does the Promised Messiah (as).

    4. The second advent of Jesus will be an Imam from among the Muslims (Bukhari Vol.2 page 411)
    So, the Promised Messiah would be from among the Muslim Ummah: imaamukum minkum – the Promised Messiah (as) was from among the Ummah.

    5. Islam would have three centuries of greatness, then it would ascend
    back to heaven for a thousand years (Bukhari vol.4 in conjunction with
    the Holy Quran (86:1).
    Muhammad salAllahu ‘alayhi wa sallam prophesised through inference, that the Messiah was to appear at the head of Islam’s fourteenth century. Jesus came at the beginning of the fourteenth century after Moses, and the founder of the Ahmadiyya Movement in Islam, Hazrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad appeared at the beginning of Islam’s fourteenth century.

    6. Allah will send Masih ibne Maryam (Messiah son of Mary). Thus he will descend near the White Eastern Minaret of Damascus, clad in two yellow sheets, leaning on the shoulders of two angels. (Sahih Muslim, Vol. 8, P. 192-193).
    The Prophet salAllahu ‘alaihe wa sallam is also said to have “pointed towards the East”. It is obvious that India, especially the area of Punjab is situated to the East of Mecca. Further, the Promised Messiah alayhi slaam states:
    “Similarly it has also been stated in the Hadith reports that the Promised Mahdi would be the inhabitant of a village called Kad‘ah or Kadyah. Now every intelligent man can understand
    that the word Kad‘ah is, in fact, an abbreviation for Qadian. As for the words occurring in some reports that “Kad‘ah is a village in the settlements of Yemen,” these are not the words of a
    hadith but is the opinion of a reporter based on his own judgment. Perhaps by finding that there was a village in Yemen whose name resembled this, someone thought that maybe that
    was the village intended. But it is clear that at present there is no such village flourishing in the land of Yemen, nor has anyone in that land made such a claim. However, Qadian exists
    at this time and moreover the claimant to the offices of Messiah and Mahdi also exists.”

    Now to the latter part of your claim. Let us look at some Prophecies that the Promised Messiah alayhi salaam made:

    1. The Promised Messiah (as) announced that if Pandit Lekh Ram did not desist in his attacks towards Islam, then he would meet a bitter end within six years from February 20 1893.
    “Like the calf of Samiri, lekh Ram shall be cut into pieces.”

    He also foretold that his death would take place near the festival of Eid. On March 6 1897, a day after Eid, Pandit Lekh Ram was stabbed with a dagger and his insides were mutilated.

    2. The Promised Messiah (as) predicted the Great Earthquake of Karanga. In 1185 he received this revelation which was repeated in 1903 and 1904. On April 3 1905, one day before the Earthquake, the Promised Messiah (as) claimed to have had a revelation reminding him that the hour of destruction has arrived.

    3. At the time when Hadhrat Masih-Maud (as) was entering upon his mission, Amir Habibullah Khan sat upon the throne of Kabul. He was averse to the Ahmadiyya Movement. A revelation came to the Promised Messiah (as) that two of his dear followers will be slain in that land. This prophecy came to pass in the year 1903 when Sahibzada Abdul Latif Sahib and his disciple Shaykh Abdul Rahman were brutally martyred by order of Habibullah Khan.

    4. On January 1 1906, another similar message was revealed to the Promised Messiah (as) that three more sheep of his fold will be killed. in 1925, this prophecy came to fulfilment when by order of King Amanullah Khan, Maulvi Nematullah, Maulvi Abdul Hakim and Mullah Nur Ali were stoned to death.

    When the Earth cries of injustices and shakes with anger, the heavens answer. Thus Allah (Swt)’s wrath was evident. Habibullah Khan fell victim to the murderous machinations of his own kith and kin. Amanullah Khan was disgracefully driven away from his kingdom by so small a soldier, Bacha Saqa who had with him a measly 300 men. Amanullah Khan had a large force with him and made an attempt to regain his lost throne. A bloody battle was fought in which around an estimated 100,000 men were slain. In this way another prophecy was fulfilled, pronounced on April 15 1905:
    “About 85,000 men shall be slain in the dominion of Kabul.”
    King Amanullah Khan fled for his life and never returned.

    Is there a need to go on further, because I will gladly do so.

    (p.s. Sorry for it being so long)
    Wassalaam

  59. Assalamoalikum
    sorry about the mistake above.
    Respected brother tauseef said I quote, I have many non-ahmadi friends, I love them because they believe in the Holy Prophet (saw) , and he said If an ahmadi wants to be a friends with non-ahmadi that is own decision.
    I understand that is a balanced opinion, but if having a balanced opinion means listening to
    slander and disrespect for the promise messiah (alayhi al-salam) then we don,t need to be communicating or sharing views. you are right to say that not all non-ahmadis behave in that manner. as for risking being alienated, that,s ok to as allah subhanahu wa ta ala, knows best
    Wassalam

  60. Cylindrical in his/her post has said that I have given a typical cultish reply. While brother theartofmisinformation has given an apt reply let me clarify what I said.

    I did not say don’t be friends with non-Ahmadis. I said look who are your close friends as that will have an influence. I have many non-Ahmadi friends, some of them very nice and respectful. I have good understanding with them, we exchange salaam when we meet, discuss studies, go out to eat and so forth. I pray for all these non-Ahmadi friends of mine so that they can see the light and accept the Imam of the age. Many of them are genuinely nice people, it is just that they have not been told the right things about Ahmadiyya Islam.

    When I was saying I do not need friendship is for one who keeps ridiculing the Promised Messiah(as). I can take abuse myself but I can’t take abuse on a Prophet of Allah. Would you like to be friends with someone who says he believes in the Holy Prophet(saw) and then also says that he believes that Hadhrat Musa(as) is [God forbid] an imposter and a liar.

    Allah says in the Holy Qur’an:

    “He has already revealed to you in the Book that, when you hear the signs of Allah being denied and mocked at, sit not with them until they engage in a talk other than that; for in that case you would be like them. Surely, Allah will assemble the hypocrites and disbelievers in Hell, all together” (4: 141)

    If they stop ridiculing the Promised Messiah(as) I will sit with them and be friends with them. If not then I can only deliver the message and move on. I don’t need such friends. I only try to follow the Holy Quran.

    In addition I also wrote that when they ‘start avoiding me or tell me I am a kafir’. So when they stop talking to me I became curious and tried to approach them they turn around and say vile things about the Promised Messiah(as) – then is when I follow the above commandment of Allah.

    But when I find an opportunity I still approach them but they just turn around and tell me I am kafir and we should not be speaking anymore. Tell me – who finished off the friendship here.

    I do keep doing what I do. Many of them who stopped talking to me, I emailed them politely but no answer except a vile disgusting attack on the Promised Messiah(as).

    So I will reiterate I have many non-Ahmadi friends. May of whom I have very lively debates on Ahmadiyya Islam and when they see me talk of the Promised Messiah(as) in a respectful fashion they do so too. They also say the word Huzur. Then there are those who are the ones I explained two paragraphs above.

    So I am not saying don’t be friends with non-Ahmadi Muslims period! I am saying don’t be in company with those who ridicule the Promised Messiah(as). If they are respectful of course be friends with them. They will learn something about Ahmadiyya Islam.

    Islamic Societies(ISOC) in Universities have wide membership. I try to go to their events and invite them to our AMSA events. For that there is no need to be a member of ISOC. The Ahmadi students should form AMSAs and do their own events as within ISOC they won’t have a voice or be able to hold events they want.

    I still strongly believe that there is no light outside the Promised Messiah(as). The person who says he can learn more about Islam from these organisations is gravely mistaken. On the other hand the ISOC members should come to AMSA events to learn the true verities of the Holy Quran.

  61. On both Riba and the Eclipse your arguments were responded to by more than one person. The fact that you do not agree with the responses is incidental. The position put forward by sister Nemo has been supported by many Ahmadis here – if only you would look. But vision, my friend, is not an easy thing to come by these days.

  62. It’s funny that you ask for evidence; where is the evidence that this leaflet even exists? It’s a simple question, where is that notorious leaflet? Ahmadiyya maligned and attacked Muslims in London based on a leaflet that simply doesn’t exist, yet you ask me for evidence that this woman lied. Hilarious. Even the Kingston Police clearly stated that they have not seen any leaflet calling for the murder of Ahmadis.

    Which news investigation concluded that a suicide attack was planned on the Ahmadiyya community?

    [deleted – personal attack with no evidence]

    The point is that Mirza Ghulam Ahmad is not the Imam Mahdi. He hasn’t fulfilled any of the prophecies from ahadith nor his own prophecies. His failures are well documented and yet you choose to believe in him. It is you who has to re-evaluate his position and save yourself from hellfire. May Allah (SWT) guide you to Islam.

    No morsel of fact? All allegations that I have made so far are valid. You have been unable to refute a single one (riba, eclipse prophecy etc.).

    And as I said: I support Nemo’s position as far as the rest goes, because it is the most reasonable and open-minded approach.

  63. AA

    Maybe you are not up to date with these events; let me shed some light on it.
    An anti-Ahmadi group distributed these leaflets, now if you are referring to the leaflets that were distributed in Kingston on July 6th 2010.
    Sure, the Police may not be in possession of that particular leaflet, but surely someone of your nature that likes to keep a “balanced” view can clearly see that hate leaflets are shamelessly being distributed.

    If you would like to be updated on these matters the Wimbledon Guardian has conducted a full investigation in to hate crimes against the Ahmadiyya Muslim Community click here.

    Decide for yourself whether our concerns are unfounded or not.

    Wasalaam

  64. Cylindrical, you need to get your head out the sand and smell the roses dude. Your world ain’t as a Rosey as you think so chill with ahmadi bitterness and concentrate on ensuring you boys get Eid ul adha right on the same day between yourselves before you give me the Muslims ain’t got nothing to hide jibber.

    Trust me I’m not a strict ahmadi, but the cultists sure has a way of making me firmer in my convictions.

  65. 1. You indicate that the Jama’at forced a lady to do something against her will (evidence);
    2. Secondly, you indicate that a dignified Ahmadi lady lied (evidence);
    3. You indicated that respected [……..] Sahib introduced terrorism into the mix when you must know that independent news investigations have looked at this, investigated the story, ran with it and the committee members of that Mosque apologised (evidence); and
    4. You accused Tauseef Sahib of offering a Cultish reply. He has accepted the Imam of the Age (as) and he believes that his focus should be in following the teachings of that Imam, who was foretold by the Holy Prophet (sall Allahu ‘alayhi wa sallam). If you have an issue with that then re-evaluate your own position and how you would react to the Imam Mahdi if he was in front of you. Tauseef Sahib also clearly said that he had negative experiences and that many people had shared similar experiences with him. His experiences are not isolated as has been shown here through the comments of other men and women who attended various Universities. In Islam we are asked to stay away from doubtful situations and I think that on the balance of discrimination Ahmadis have faced in Islamic University Societies we can safely say that their is much doubt in these societies. Doubt not just for Ahmadis, may I add, but for all respected Muslim brothers and sisters.

    The only person who is Cultish in their approach is you. Of all the comments that were made, many praising non-Ahmadis, you honed in on a single comment and projected that as the Ahmad concensus. This is the propaganda machine that you and your cohorts have relied upon for years now. So please, before you return to cast aspersions about my respected Amir, which will not be approved, and dignified people who post here, make sure that you yourself can make statements which have at least a morsel of fact about them.

  66. This is a very strange allegation indeed from non ahmadies. How many of them allow their women to join Ahmadiyya Muslim Students’ Associations (AMSAs)? As the President of a very active AMSA in London I can tell you that it is very rare. Any non ahmadi Muslim women who join do so of their own volition, and it is not something they would publicise to their non ahmadi friends. Were they to ask one of their ISOC friends, they would of coursebe discouraged from joining, so how can the ISOC use this as a valid complaint against Ahmadis?

    Just another of a long line of absurd allegations. Unfortunately when people know that their arguments against the Promised Messiah fail they turn to small petty things to try and disuade people from the truth.

  67. Has the leaflet, that called for the murder of Ahmadis, been found yet? What a shameless propaganda coup against Muslims in London. Your leaders made a young woman lie about a leaflet on BBC News that doesn’t exist! After that [deleted] went on TV and brought suicide bombers into the mix. Love for all, hatred for none, eh?

    As for the rest: what Nemo said. A balanced view is important in order to find the truth. Tauseef on the other hand delivered a typical cultish reply, advocating isolation instead of engagement. If Ahmadiyya is the truth, what is he afraid of? We Muslims alhamdulillah don’t have to hide from anything.

  68. AA

    JazakAllah, I’m humbled by the response. I am no one special just an average person seeking knowledge. “As for me, all I know is that I know nothing.” – Socrates (as)

    Please may I request that you remember me in your prayers.
    JazakAllah
    Wasalaam

  69. Assalamoalikum
    A misconception removed indeed, we have a clear understanding as to why our son,s and daughter,s should not get involved at university as many of us have had a negative experience concerning our faith. our job as mothers is to protect our children against such malice, hatred, lies. it is our job to keep them on the right path, the path of the righteous. that is the very advice our sadr lajna had given in her letter which was misrepresented by the cult website.
    Apprise people of the unity of Jamat Ahmadiyyat and it,s need. the word islam and ahmadiyyat that are divergent these day,s they are one of the same religion. they want to alter religion according to their own wishes. Tell them to rule the world but permit Allah subhanahu wa ta ala , to rule their own selves

    wassalam

  70. I felt that my friends involved in the Muslim society just wanted a sense of belonging and being part of something. That’s when I realised that maybe they needed a khuddam type organisation as once uni was over they did not have that same link anymore. Some of us knock our setup, but trust me my muslim friends used to aknowledge our structure even though they where anti!

    In my univeristy the muslim society also had internal beef, ie The khilafat movement, HT lot v the less anti west, I just wana do my namaz and go type Muslim. There was also a big thing about radicalising Muslims as several members where arrested for acts of terrorism. Was big news at the time.

    However the other factor was the bad rep they had with other faith societies to.

    All said and done I made some great non ahmadi Muslim friends, but they where individuals who had far to much on to spend getting involved with any negativity.

    I hear the ishmalies are quite chilled out, not that I know many.

  71. MashAllah. What an inspiring and heart touching post AhmadiMuslimah! Once again, you have raised my expectations – the amount of knowledge, passion and love that is in the air is phenomenal. May Allah (swt) bless you.

    Whilst I was at Uni, I experienced similar scenarios. May Allah (swt) bless this jamaat – i wish i was present at that event, and I wish our scholars had come to my University. I was not quiet about my Ahmadi beliefs, which landed me to be labelled as a Kafir to the point where I had a hard time not from the sisters alhamdolillah but from the “brothers”. One thing I will say is that the sisters (although they wanted to bring me “back” to the “real islam”) were not completely against me since they had seen that I was quite similar to them bar this one thing – that i was alhamdolillah an Ahmadi.
    Personally, I agree to some extent with Brother Tauseef – I personally did not benefit from learning from the University students that I was with – they were lovely people but what would I learn from someone who has not accepted the Imam of the age – what benefit will they be to me in terms of Islamic knowledge or spirituality? Everything I would yearn for and need is in each and every word and action of the Prophet salAllahu ‘alaihe wa sallam, in each and every word of the Promised Messiah alaihe salaam, in each and every speech of the Khulafa. What then are University students who have not accepted these going to teach me?

    I am not being arrogant. I am not boasting and I do not hold any pride. Everything I have and I believe in is from Allah (swt)’s blessings and Grace – that He blessed me to have done the Bai’at at the hands of the Khalifa and to accept the message. That He blessed this worthless being to be an Ahmadi.

    Some people say that our jama’ah is not dealing with issues that the Muslim or non-ahmadi scholars are dealing with. To be honest – I saw some truth in this some years back. This was a fault within myself. When I began to really listen to Hudhur’s speeches – he was addressing exactly those issues but went even further and deeper in expounding on issues which really matter: Spirituality, Purification of the soul, seeking forgiveness – all such things which are going to affect our end result – and that is the crux of our life. Our goal is to attain Allah (swt)’s pleasure and that is exactly what Hudhur is always stressing and trying to direct us towards. Unfortunately, the problem is we do not listen to our beloved Hudhur but run to listen to the non-ahmadi scholars in a jiffy even if it costs us 25 quid a pop! There is no harm in this – but prioritization is the key.

    May Allah (swt) guides us all
    I seek forgiveness for any wrong I have said.

  72. As Ahmadi Muslims, we are different from the rest of the Muslim Ummah.

    This is clear.

    Students are, very generally speaking, between the ages of 16 to say around 22-24. Now this is a very impressionable age in which the wrong type of influence can play a huge part in leading them astray and confusing them as not all muslims are at the same level of spirituality.

    What is needed in such situations is a “big sister/brother” to guide students and thats where the Ahmadiyya Muslim Student Association and the Ahmadiyya Muslim Women’s Student Association play a pivotal role.

    By not joining Islamic societies (other than AMSA or AMWSA) students are not denied Islamic knowledge, furthermore these students are encouraged to participate in propagating Islam and thus increase their learning.

    Ahmadi’s are not covert Muslim’s, we openly declare our Islam and by posing as non Ahmadi’s, sneakily trying to infiltrate other societies we do not stoop to the levels of the munafiqin. And yes, we would have to declare ourselves non Ahmadi’s to be part of these societies – do you think they’d let us be part of their group if they don’t tolerate us as being in the same room as them?

    We will, God Willing, never be left behind by joint joining such societies, I assure you that!
    Allah the Almighty, Who is the Knower of All Things, has promised to send the message of the Promised Messiah to the corners of the earth.

    I know not all Muslims are bad- I was a Sunni Muslim; my parents and the rest of my family are still non Ahmadi, and they are good people.

    People who have Taqwa never run the risk of “alienation”

    Wassalaam

  73. As a former president of AMSA at my local university, i can personally testify the truthfulness of these stories. We always try to work together with the MSA on campus, but they straight refuse to. Instead they bring big bearded maulvis to our tabligh kiosk at the student center to debate us. It has gotten to the point were MSA members come in big groups to our table and debate us and say derogatory things. If this is the hate inside their members, i wouldn’t want even a khadim to join that group let alone a lajna member. But then again, that is just the situation at my university and may not be the case in others.

  74. Good topic and believe the essence of any society is to welcome and educate others on their beliefs without creating any discomfort.

    In my own experience I used to attend Sikh society talks as well as Christian. Ironically when I went to the Islamic society talk with my good friends, the subject turned to qadiyanism.

    Suffice it to say that was an awkward 40 minutes as I sat quietly listening to the laughter and barrage of allegations and unjustified insults. Was the last time I attended however I still see where nemo is coming from. It’s good to expand your mind and learn about others, however the ‘others’ need to be open to differing view points to.

    All in all this Life is a journey and sometimes you need to find answers yourself as opposed to what people tell you is correct. My advise to ubi students is learn about all societies and cultures as it will ultimately shape you and in my experience, appriciate ahmadiyyat even more.

  75. Assalamu Alaikkum, like the artofmisinformation, I see your point. In fact in my work place a couple of us Ahmadis joined an Islamic Society. We decided that rather than openly declaring who we are straight away we will wait for sometime in order to avoid confrontation etc. We were accepted and within a short period of time. There were a lot of people who seemed very nice and polite. We used to be involved in a lot of discussion covering a variety of topics. socio-political, religion etc. For a lot of discussions we would provide useful material – all from Jama’at sources, but without giving it away. We got a lot of positive feedback. Some people even took the material with them to use for discussion amongst their friends. All of this went well and we started to think that perhaps some kind of positive impression is left on some minds and perhaps it is a good time to introduce them to Ahmadiyyat, A discussion about (dis)unity amongst Ummah presented us with an opportunity. We presented our argument. But we could do not believe how quickly they became hostile. The same people who were nice and polite before turned very upfront and confrontational. What shocked me most was the venom in their attack on the Promised Messiah(AS). Even on other issues our views were being constantly challenged; just for the sake of it, perhaps it was hard to accept anything from “Qadiyanis”. These were the same people who we used to have lively discussions with. There was no point in continuing actively in that society. I am happy to deal with individuals who are not prejudiced and willing to listen and respect.

  76. Salaam all,

    Just wanted to make one or two points.

    1) There have been, from my university ISOC (UCL), two prominent members-one of whom was the head of the ISOC in recent years-were arrested for acts of attempted terrorism. You would have heard of the “Underwear bomber” I presume…http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Umar_Farouk_Abdulmutallab

    As a result of this, all people who had ever signed up to the ISOC, even if in passing, over the past 5 years, from 2005-2010, had to hand in their details to the Metropolitan Police under the Terrorism Act.

    If not for ANY other reason (of which there are quite a few listed above), I would suggest all ahmadis keep away from joining the ISOC (making friends is your own personal choice-indeed, I have non-ahmadi muslim friends who are lovely people and, knowing that I am an ahmadi, treat me with respect and kindness).

  77. I see both of your points.

    Brother Tauseef, May Almighty Allah bless you for being such a passionate Ahmadi and your very apparent love.

    Nemo: I agree that it is important we always try to avoid alienation. I am sure you will agree that that ambition can be quite a struggle at times. Just like Tauseef Sahib, I have also had similar reactions from the majority of friends I have made at University in which they saw it as almost a badge of honour to make the usual very insensitive comments to me about Hadrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad (‘alayhi al-salam). Nevertheless, the fact that something is a struggle often means that one should persevere and keep trying.

    I personally have never had a desire to join an Islamic society at University. The few that I have had experiences with have made me feel that as an open Ahmadi I would feel out of place and uncomfortable existing within them. As far as individuals are concerned, I treat each and every person in exactly the same way. I hold a good opinion of them (husn al-zan) and wish for them that which I wish for myself. Any peace loving person is a friend of mine.

  78. AA
    JazakAllah for taking the time to respond.
    I haven’t stated that non-Ahmadis are bad, anti-ahmadi or fundamentalists. I, myself was a non-Ahmadi and it’s by the Grace of Almighty Allah I am a convert to Islam Ahmadiyya, Alhumdolillah. Some of my really good friends are non-Ahmadi Muslims and non-Muslims, for that matter. This article is in no way implying to limit ones experience or to only socialise with one group of people.

    This isn’t about belief, I am simply highlighting the reasoning behind advice given by Lajna Imaillah and why it is their duty to provide such awareness.
    I totally agree with you, that to have true knowledge of something, you must experience it. But, you don’t need to walk into a burning house to know that it is hot and harmful, you can see the smoke and the fire from afar.

    For example, when the London Riots occurred I saw a change in people, there were less people on the streets and towns were eerily quiet during the evenings. News channels advised parents to keep their children inside, this wasn’t to alienate people but for their safety.

    Parents are not solely responsible for their children, we all have a duty of care towards each other and I guess this why there is a breakdown in society.

    May Allah have mercy on us all.

    Wasalaam

  79. I agree with the posters above. If the Uni ISOC in general were tolerant and welcoming of Ahmadi Muslims and happy to discuss issues rationally without prejudice I think more Ahmadis would join in and such advice would not be forthcoming from Lajna or other auxillary organisations. Unfortunately as many members know having been to Uni the situation is quite different. In my case many of my so called Muslim friends from ISOC turned against me with blind prejudice to the point that when I was going to Umrah they threatned to report me as an Ahmadi to the embassy if I tried to obtain a visa. These were otherwise normal rational people. It is quite shocking to see the extreme sometimes irrational prejudice against Ahmadi Muslims that has been instilled by the so called scholars in Pakistan and UK. May Allah help us overcome their fears and prejudice and allow true faith in the Imam of the age to enter their hearts.

    Salam

  80. If an Ahmadi wants to be a friend with a non-Ahmadi that is his own decision. However, he should look also at who his close friends are. The company he keeps will influence him.

    I have had many non-Ahmadi friends. However, my first and foremost duty is to let them know that I love them because they believe in the Holy Prophet(saw) and I wish they would also see the light of new Sun that is the Promised Messiah(as). I also want them to come close to God and thus be within the company of the righteous.

    You know as well as I do that the Holy Quran says “Be with the righteous”. If they ridicule the Promised Messiah and consider him an imposter. And does not listen and does not change his stance why should I keep friendship with him.

    I disagree with your statement:
    “However college/university students should not be made to feel like they have done something wrong by joining an islamic union. They should be entitled to balanced opinions. After all, by knowing what exactly goes on in these groups, they can not only increase Islamic knowledge, but also see what other muslim’s responses are to contemporary issues and perhaps adopt these into their life as long as they don’t go against ahmadi teachings too.”

    What kind of ‘balanced’ opinion would an Islamic Society membership bring. I go to the prayer room in my University, most people I meet there generally very friendly but when I tell them I am an Ahmadi they start avoiding me or tell me that I am a Kafir. I don’t need their ‘Islamic knowledge’ or their ‘responses to contemporary issues’ to improve my knowledge. If they don’t heed the message of the Imam of the age what can I learn from them. As Promised Messiah(as) as rightly said: “Do you seek a blind man to show you the way”.

    I have the Holy Qur’an, the Hadith, the books of the Promised Messiah(as) and the rightly guided Khulafa for all my knowledge. Thank you very much.

    Remember you will find no light outside that illumined by the Promised Messiah Hadhrat Mirza Ghulam Ahmad(as) who has written in Fateh Islam:

    “I hold a light in my hand. Those who come to me must receive their share of this light. But those who fall into delusions or distrust and run away from me will enter into darkness. I am the invincible fortress raised for you today. He who enters me saves himself from thieves and robbers and wild animals. But he who wishes to live at a distance from my walls runs the risk of life everywhere on all sides. Even his dead body may not survive.”

  81. Yes I agree, AMWSA is an excellent organisation for Ahmadi students to join as the society is officially governed by the Jama’at.

  82. I humbly serve as the National Mohtamim of Amoor-e-Tuluba (Student Affairs) [Majlis Khuddamul Ahmadiyya UK].

    One of my active AMSA members is writing an article on AMSA and how it empowers Ahmadi students – will be sent to you soon.

    The Lajna, infact everyone, is welcome to come to AMSA events. However it should be noted that any communication between AMSA and AMWSA should be via Sadr Majlis Khuddamul Ahmadiyya and Sadr Sahiba Lajna Ima’illah.

  83. AA,

    I remember attending a forum on Jihad which was organised by a non Ahmadi Islamic Society, hoping to find out the true meaning of Jihad.

    Once I was sitting in there it was a whole different story.

    The people leading the talk seemed as if they were on a mission to “recruit”. I wont repeat the foul language that was used but it was condoning the 9/11 atrocities and other such terrorism.

    I stayed till the end, partly fearful of the backlash I’d receive from leaving the event and partly because I was hoping they would somehow do justice to the subject. It didn’t.

    Over the next few months, a handful students had taken time out of the busy semester, at the detriment to their studies, to “visit family” in Pakistan.

    We all knew what was going on.

    Then there was the issue of girls match-making under the banner of the Islamic Society. Once a suitor was found, the non mehram girls acted as chaperones whilst the “couple” met.

    These are a few of the many issues faced by so called Islamic Societies in schools, colleges and universities. They are the playgrounds in which young impressionable minds can be groomed and corrupted.

    May Allah protect all young people.

  84. Jazak Allah Tauseef, perhaps you could share with us, for those who might not know, what your MKA role is when you are away from research and thebeerevelation? Also, if AMWSA want to set up an event, but are short on manpower, are they able to ask AMSA for help with setting the venue up – logistics, etc?

  85. Very good article Ahmadi Muslimah. Masha’Allah.

    I would like to say that Ahmadi Khuddam students should form AMSAs and Lajna AMWSA across all Universities.

    We have a very active AMSA in UCL and Queen Mary University. In the past years we have had events on ‘Is God Dead?’, ‘Women in Islam’, ‘Islam and Terrorism’, and ‘Jesus in India’. All were very well received by the students. Unfortunately, but when we advertised our event via posters in the University, the posters near the Prayer Room were taken down within 15 minutes. Who took them down? You can figure that out yourself. This is another reason why Ahmadi youth should be joining AMSAs and not ISOC.

    Anyways that does not deter us. This year more events are being planned including Apostasy in the Islamic Republic, Jesus in India, Why evolution needs God and so forth.

    If you are an Ahmadi Khadim student and want to join AMSA please send me an email.

  86. Thank you for this Ahmadi Muslimah. You have provided a positive response. I myself was chucked out of a prayer room by the non-ahmadis once upon a time! Perhaps it is right that people do exercise caution when making friends with people who could potentially spread hatred. And as a general guidance issued by the jamaat that would be a good thing.

    However college/university students should not be made to feel like they have done something wrong by joining an islamic union. They should be entitled to balanced opinions. After all, by knowing what exactly goes on in these groups, they can not only increase Islamic knowledge, but also see what other muslim’s responses are to contemporary issues and perhaps adopt these into their life as long as they don’t go against ahmadi teachings too. Otherwise we risk being left behind. Not all non-ahmadi muslims are bad and anti ahmadi, or fundamentalists. Like in all aspects of life, there are bad and good people. I had a muslm friend who never held a grudge at me being an ahmadi, and that person never tried to ‘bring me over to the other side’. Also, yes, students are at a really impressionable age, but being able to think freely, outside of the box, and being able to see what else goes on is all part of growing up and being able to integrate into our society, which consists of many non-ahmadi muslims. Otherwise we risk alienation.

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